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How to install a Garelick outboard bracket

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/16/2008 : 22:21:01

<Edited to fix tiny photos>

Warning, photo essay, lots of pictures, and long winded.

When I bought my new Tohatsu 9.8 XLS last week, I expected to just clamp it on the transom & start figuring out how I was going to build a hard link for it. This was not to be, apparently the transom on the older boats like mine is narrower than the newer boats, so I was not able to turn the engine without bumping either the tiller against the fuel locker, or the shifter against the round down. What to do?

After [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17416"]consulting the forum[/url] and doing some casting about on my own, I decided to mount the engine on a [url="http://www.garelick.com/product.php?pnumber=71091"]Garelick 71090[/url] bracket.

Here's what the stern of the boat looked like before I started:

Some elbow grease, a sharp scraper and some patience got it looking like this:

And countersinking the existing holes so they can be filled with epoxy. I used a 1/2" countersink bit to make a nice cone shaped hole. That got rid of all the existing caulk that was in the holes so I'd get a nice seal.

Then I took a photo of the stern of the boat, imported it into AutoCAD, superimposed a bitmap of the engine from Tohatu's site and scaled it to size. Then I outlined the stern of the boat with lines so I could start figuring out where best to mount the engine. I made another scale model of the Garelick mount and drew it in as well. I "mounted" the engine on the Garelick and moved it up & down. I was hoping that at full extension (all the way up), I could get the propeller out of the water, but that wasn't possible, so instead I opted to have the anti-cavitation plate just submerged when the engine was all the way up, which would put the prop nearly a foot & a half down into the water when it was all the way down:

After I got the mount where I liked it in the virtual world, it was time to make it happen in the real world. I spent some time figuring out where the center of the transom was, and how far down I needed to mount the bracket. I'll spare you the math, but basically it came down to figuring out where the top of the bracket was going to be at full extension, and subtracting 27-1/2" (transom to anti-cavitation plate on a Tohatsu XLS) from that height to place the bracket on the stern. Once I had that figured out, I just had to mark it on the stern. I did that using a board clamped to the top of the transom at the line marking what would be the top of the bracket. Once I had that figured out, I drilled a tiny pilot hole to see where it would fall inside the stern of the boat. You can just barely see it in the top right of the photo, about an inch to the left of the shadow of the clamp:

Then I crawled inside the stern of the boat to see where it fell. You really can't see it because the hole is so small, but there's a tiny hole right where the bulge of the transom is. If I drilled there, I'd have the bolt coming through an angled piece of fiberglass. The hole is in the far left of the picture right on the slope:

After looking at that, I decided to use the second from the top set of holes in the bracket, which would get me down into the meat of the transom w/o compromising much strength. I used at 7/8" hole saw to drill through for the oversized holes to back fill with epoxy. I used the same tiny drill to make pilot holes, in retrospect I should have used a larger drill for the pilot holes, but only because the holes were so hard to see on the inside of the boat, even with the sun behind them. It didn't make any difference on the bottom holes because the fiberglass there is only about 3/8" thick, but the top holes were probably 1-1/2" deep. I only drilled part of the way though with the hole saw, then went inside to drill the rest of the way to keep from chipping out the fiberglass. While this was a good idea, as you'll see, it only worked out so-so. I attribute this to having to simply make my best guess about where the pilot holes were from the tiny chips that popped out on the inside. Here's what it looked like on the outside:

And then on the inside, you can fairly clearly see the lower, larger pilot holes drilled by the hole saw, and if you look really-really-really closely, you can see the tiny pilot holes (just kidding, I could barely see them when I was in there, I'd be amazed if you saw them in the photo):

And then after the holes are drilled. It was a strange sensation having four holes large enough to easily sink my boat in my transom, I tried not to start calculating how fast she'd go down...:

And here's what it looked like on the outside afterwards. Notice the chip out, and the not so straight holes. Oh, well, it worked out in the end:

You can see the Gorilla tape I used to close off the back of the holes so the epoxy had something to be pushed against. I mixed up a batch of [url="http://www.westsystem.com/"]West System epoxy[/url] with a fairly large amount of [url="http://www.westsystem.com/webpages/productinfo/guide/index.htm#fillers"]404 additive[/url] to thicken & strengthen the epoxy. I spooned it in with a big popsicle stick & spreader, trying to make sure that the holes had no voids in them. The day turned cold and rainy, so the epoxy took forever to kick, it finally gelled after about two hours, but even seven hours after that, it has still not cured. I kept my little Coleman propane heater on it for nearly the whole nine hours to "accelerate" the curing process. Finally about 9pm, I was no longer able to dent it with my finger nail.

I bought some 1" x 1/4" aluminum stock to make backing plates for the 3/8" bolts, as well as some large SS fender washers. I drilled the 3/8" mounting holes through the epoxy and I also cut down one of Rita's UHMW cutting boards to make a backing plate for the front of the bracket to sit against the transom, between it and the bracket. I drilled it as well, then countersunk all the holes with the same 1/2" bit so the caulk would form little gaskets around each of the holes. I added a generous amount of caulk around all the holes as well as the UHMW plate and adhered it to the transom & mounted the bracket with the help of my neighbor. I crawled inside the boat & tightened up all the nuts against the backing plates till my neighbor saw squeeze out all the way around the plate. Then I came back outside, ran a final bead of caulk all the way around so it'd look nice & have a nice seal all the way around.

Here's the final result:

I was shooting for the anti-cavitation plate to be even with the water line, I think I missed by about half an inch, but I'll live with it.

Here's all the way down:

Here's another shot with it tilted up:

Edited to fix tiny photos.

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Edited by - delliottg on 04/08/2009 18:43:55

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 06:20:18

David,
from your pics I'm not so sure that the OB well on your boat is any narrower than on our 2005 model. I think it's the Tohatsu model that is different.
on our 2005 Tohatsu, the gear shift is on the stbd side of the cowling (Up = neutral, Back = Astern, Forwards = ..) The OB tiller also pivots from a point further aft on the engine.

Nicely explained installation, let's know how it goes when your boat is in the water.

Paul

Edited by - on

jlannutti
Navigator

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USA
102 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 06:41:56

David,
Thats just about the best explanation of a mod that I've ever seen. (While I'm relatively new here I've been in Columbia, J-Boat, and Catboat, groups for a long time.) Once you splash the boat I'd be interested in knowing what effect the rearward transfer of the engine weight has on how the boat sits in the water. I have a transom mounted '97 Honda 9.9 with electric start & alternator (a very heavy package)I've already added about 60 lbs. of ballast to the v-berth locker to get it to sit properly along the waterline. I don't know if you already had some ballast there but you may need to add more. Also, do you think you'll be able to tile the engine forward with the bracket up in order to get the prop out of the water either when sailing or in your slip? Great job!

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 13:13:34

Paul,
That probably explains it, the shifter is now up front on the forward corner of the starboard side of the engine and it's paddle shaped, and the tiller is pretty much opposite on the port side. Both of them hit no matter what I did.

Joe,
Thanks for the nice comment, I appreciate it.
The PO had three 50 pound bags of pea gravel in the bow of the boat, and I just left it there. I agree that there'll probably a bit of squatting now that the engine is further back and 40 pounds heavier. I might have to add another bag of sand or gravel up there, or maybe a couple of 25 pound bags of lead shot shoved all the way forward under the anchor locker, not sure.

Here are a couple of pictures of the engine tilted in the up & down configurations. In either case I don't think my next door neighbor's going to be happy, his way into his slip is already pretty restricted, the engine being further back isn't going to help.

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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3444 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 13:28:56

Looks great. Mine is mounted flush with the top of the opening. It looks like you gain 4 or 5 inches of depth. Any concern about the cockpit drains pouring water over the mount? It looks like the transom is solid fiberglass, is it or is it cored?

Will your marina charge you for 3 feet of overhang? Assuming of course that you have a 25ft slip.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 14:10:49

John,
The transom is cored at the top, and solid fiberglass at the bottom. About 1-1/2" & 3/8" respectively, at least where I drilled for the bolts.

As far as the drain goes, it'll go over the top of the UHMW cutting board which is sealed pretty tightly against the transom and caulked. The bracket itself is all SS or anodized aluminum so I'm not too worried about it. It was designed for saltwater exposure, so any runoff from the scuppers should be taken in stride. Also, I took extra care to run a nice smooth bead all the way around the cutting board after I tightened up the bracket. I shouldn't have any leaks, although I plan to test that over the weekend with Rita spraying water with the hose onto the mount from all different angles while I'm inside watching for leaks.

Fortunately I'm in a 30' slip, but part of the reason I'm in there is because of the 43' boat next to me needing extra room to get in and out. Having it hanging out there isn't likely to make him all warm & fuzzy. I'll be parking the boat at an angle to reduce the pressure on him. It'll be easy to do with a line to my port mid ship's cleat to pull it away, then tuck my stern in closer to the dock to maximize the room for him to maneuver. I can always leave the engine in the shallow water configuration, although I'm not too sure how secure that is.

Edited by - on

piseas
Former Treasurer

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USA
2017 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 15:25:33

David, very nice job, especially with auto cad! Hey anyway, I thought the Garelick mount brought the motor straight up and out of water. I have a Honda with the original mount but my motor comes much more forward. I am not crazy about motor sticky out. Anyway, let us know how Tohatsu performs.
Steve A

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/17/2008 : 23:24:57

Steve,
I have to agree with you, having the engine further back presents problems with accessibility. I'm looking into a [url="http://www.powertiller.net/"]Power Tiller[/url], but I'm not sure that they're still in business. They haven't responded to my request for a quote yet, so I'll probably give them a call. They're current on their website according to [url="http://www.whois.net/whois_new.cgi?d=powertiller&tld=net"]WhoIs[/url], but their most recent update is from 2005. We'll see. If nothing else, I'll need to figure out how to reach the shifter & throttle while docking. I'm thinking a [url="http://www.amazon.com/Weston-31-0601-W-Tiller-Extension-Universal/dp/B000VQEY0K/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1208492585&sr=8-1"]throttle extender thingy[/url], and some sort of shifter extension. Plus I need to figure out how I'm going to work a hard or soft link.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 10:34:37

It appears you will only need to barely tilt the engine to get it out of the water... assuming you have several detents on the tilt. My Honda only needed to be on the first stop.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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3704 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 11:54:41

David, why did you choose the adjustable bracket rather than a fixed bracket from Garhauer or Catalina?

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zebra50
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 12:05:11

David
Great explination and photos. I will be replacing my 98 Nissan 8hp with the same motor, however mine will have tiller controls on the pedestal and electric start. Do you think that I will also have the turning problem once the tiller etc. are removed?

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 13:06:43

Randy,
Several factors influenced my decision.

I took a look at the fixed brackets, and wasn't impressed with their rigidity. I was concerned that the weight of the engine constantly flexing the metal would eventually fatigue and cause failure. Plus the attachment points seemed thin to me and I was afraid of creating hinge points on my transom that would similarly fatigue & fail. This may all be incorrect on my part, but the heft of the bracket I chose seemed adequate to the task. Finally, I couldn't find any fixed brackets that were rated for four stroke engines. It seemed safer to go with a bracket designed specifically for the application I needed it for.

One of the problems we've experienced has been cavitation whenever I'd go forward to work on the foredeck. With an extensible bracket, I could gain nearly a foot of extra depth keeping the prop from cavitating (hopefully), plus with the engine mounted further back, the fulcrum of the lever moves back as well. Of course I may have to add weight to the bow to compensate, we'll see.

Of course there are other tradeoffs, the engine sticks out more both down & tilted up which isn't necessarily good. It makes the engine harder to reach, something I'm fairly concerned about, but I'm casting about for solutions to the various problems presented by this. An outboard extension handle takes care of a lot of them, and rigging some sort of shifter extension will take care of most of the rest. That leaves starting & stopping it. If I can get it into & out of gear when necessary and throttle it down to an idle, then being able to remotely start & stop it doesn't concern me too much. Stopping it seems easy enough, simply yank the lanyard, but that presents it's own problems, what if you need to start right back up again?

Obviously there are going to be problems to work out, but I'm happy with the install and have high hopes for it.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 13:14:05

Jay,
I think you'll be OK if the tiller & shift handle are removed. If you want, I can give you measurements of the width of the engine w/o the shifter & tiller.

Or at least I can when it stops snowing & hailing outside.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
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Response Posted - 04/18/2008 : 15:13:26

Makes sense and that extra depth will be a real help when you cruise. Funny how one project can lead to another, and another......

Edited by - on

zebra50
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Response Posted - 04/20/2008 : 09:41:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by delliottg
 Jay,
I think you'll be OK if the tiller & shift handle are removed. If you want, I can give you measurements of the width of the engine w/o the shifter & tiller.

Or at least I can when it stops snowing & hailing outside.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Hopefully mine will be ready by the second week in May, that is if our weather cooperates. The size, and movement etc. cant be any worse than what I have with my old Nissan 8hp.

Edited by - on

Dave Brown
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Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 18:54:15

<Mr Gonsalves,
Nice job!!!!
With the lay out work, and the mock up befoe the drilling, you must have been in the Craft.
Like I said, nice job.
D. B.
___________/)____________/)_______________/))))______________

.

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 04/09/2009 : 10:05:51

Has anyone ever tried switching the ladder to Starboard, turning the OB cutout into a boarding spot? Then you could mount an OB mount on the Port side and have a set-up like other boats. I have owned both the Garelick and the Garhauer and the Garhauer has more drop which allows the ob to go deeper, or, the mount to be placed higher. Those Garelicks sure are pretty though. I also do not understand the big bore/epoxy fill idea, seems like you now have an 4 epoxy corks waiting to pull out. I think backing plates are a better way to strengthen an area and caulk works fine to prevent water intrusion, my 2 cents.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/09/2009 : 10:56:08

Frank,
The port side transom is already flush to the foot well, I'm not sure I see any advantage to moving the ladder to the other side. The starboard side transom has the lip for mounting the OB on so you'd have to step over that if you were boarding there. Plus there'd be a lot of work with the pushpit rails to sort out.

As far as the epoxy corks go, I agree with your concern which is why I used large aluminum backing straps across the mounting holes, as well as a thick UHMW plate between the mount & the transom. I wish I had thought to taper the holes, but it simply never occurred to me. Since the hole sawn holes didn't exactly line up, I have sort of an eccentric plug, at least in the top where it was quite thick. In the bottom, I'm not sure there was much to be done, it was only 3/8" thick there.

With the Garelick mount, I'm able to get my prop about 18" below the waterline. They make two variants of the same mount, one gives you 9" of throw, and the other 15". I couldn't find the 15" model, but the 9" is seemingly more than adequate. I haven't had the prop cavitate once since putting it on, but then again we haven't been in any big weather either.

Edited by - on

wegman
1st Mate

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Response Posted - 06/13/2010 : 13:59:16

Nice job, well executed and extremely well thought out.

When creating a bolt hole in a cored surface, the method I have read about and used is:

1- drill a slightly oversize hole through the outer skin layer (fiberglass) and the core (usually balsa) but not through the inner skin layer.
2- apply some epoxy, without thickeners, to the balsa, to saturate the balsa and ensure a good bond with the next step.
3- fill the oversize hole with thickened epoxy, perhaps a bit thicker than peanut butter. Cover with wax paper for release.
4- let the epoxy harden.
5- drill the bolt hole into the hardened, thickened epoxy.
6- caulk and install the bolt (and whatever gear is being installed).

The thickened epoxy "plug" prevents water transmission in the core, and it strengthens the area of the bolt. This is especially important in horizontal surfaces, such as the deck.

This process is time consuming, so manufacturers do not use it. But for our DIY projects I think it makes sense.

Best,

Jerry

Edited by - on

maha
Deckhand

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5 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2010 : 16:15:09

I just bought an outboard motor and may be encountering the same situation as you.
2010 Tohatsu MFS9.8A3EFUL
9.8 HP four-stroke, 25" shaft, Electric Start, Tiller Handle
I mounted the motor on the transom of my "new" 2006 C250K and find that the motor tiller which is on the port side hits up against the gas locker when steering starboard, and clears very nicely when steering to port. I am tempted to lock the motor down so that it cannot steer and use my rudder/tiller to do the steering. I am also concerned that the combination of the rudder and motor can easily create the situation in which the motor prop hits the rudder. I'm not too excited about another big project right now. I just want to get the boat hull antifoulant paint done and go sailing.
I would really appreciate your comments on this. What should I do???

Edited by - on

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